Church & State 250+
Experience the complete Church & State 250+ series in one place. These conversations trace how religion has shaped American identity, institutions, law, race, politics, and public life from before the founding through the present day. Select any episode below to watch the full interview. You can also go to the full playlist here:
Mark Charles - Doctrine of Discovery
“You cannot discover lands that are already inhabited. You can conquer those lands, you can steal those lands, you can colonize those lands, but you can’t discover them if there are people already living there.”
How did Christian theology give European nations the authority to claim lands already inhabited by Indigenous peoples? Navajo writer and activist Mark Charles explains the Doctrine of Discovery, its influence on the founding of the United States, and its continuing presence in American law.
L. Daniel Hawk - Manifest Destiny
“Manifest Destiny is the conviction that the United States has a divine or providential destiny to expand and take the entire continent.”
Why did so many Americans view territorial expansion as part of God’s plan? Biblical scholar L. Daniel Hawk examines how scripture, national mythology, and ideas of American exceptionalism were used to justify conquest, Indigenous removal, and westward expansion.
Matthew Avery Sutton - Chosen Land
“Whenever we talk about the United States as a chosen land, we always have to ask: chosen for whom?”
How did generations of Christians come to view America as a land chosen by God? Historian Matthew Avery Sutton traces how Christianity shaped American identity, missionary activity, foreign policy, and ideas about who truly belonged within the nation.
Katherine Carté - Religion and the American Revolution
“The American Revolution was really a revolution about power and sovereignty. They were not fighting over the nature of baptism. They were fighting over power.”
What role did religion actually play in the American Revolution? Historian Katherine Carté explains how the Revolution disrupted the religious order of the British Empire while creating new debates over authority, national identity, establishment, and religious freedom.
John Fea - The Founders, Religion, and the Constitution
“When people fight over whether America was founded as a Christian nation, they don’t seem interested in the complete fullness and complexity of the relationship between religion and the founding.”
Was the United States established as a Christian nation? Historian John Fea examines the founders, the Constitution, religious liberty, and the historical evidence behind one of America’s most persistent political debates.
Warren Throckmorton - Founding Myths
“We do know the cross was erected. That’s in the primary source. Christian nation advocates have gone beyond the narrative and added a prayer.”
How do stories about America’s Christian founding become accepted as historical fact? Researcher Warren Throckmorton returns to the primary sources to examine fabricated quotations, embellished stories, and the myths used to support modern Christian nationalism.
Robert P. Jones - White Christianity and Race
“Race and attitudes about race run right through the heart of the history of American Christianity.”
How deeply are Christianity and white supremacy connected in American history? Robert P. Jones draws on family history, religious institutions, public monuments, and social research to show how white Christianity helped construct and preserve America’s racial hierarchy.
J. Russell “Rusty” Hawkins - The Bible and Segregation
“What civil rights activists were up against was this deeply held theological belief that God didn’t want the Supreme Court ruling to go in the direction that it did.”
How did white Southern Christians use scripture to defend segregation after Brown v. Board of Education? Historian J. Russell Hawkins examines the sermons, churches, colleges, and denominational battles that framed racial equality as a violation of biblical teaching.
Katharine Gerbner - Christian Slavery
“Protestant supremacy, I argue, is really the predecessor of white supremacy.”
Could enslaved Africans become Christians, and would baptism make them free? Historian Katharine Gerbner explains how missionaries and enslavers developed a system of “Christian slavery” that permitted conversion while protecting slavery and helped transform religious difference into racial hierarchy.
Andrew L. Seidel - Church-State Law
“Your right to exercise your religious freedom ends where the rights of other people begin.”
What does religious freedom protect, and when does it become a license to harm or control others? Constitutional attorney Andrew L. Seidel examines the legal history of church-state separation and the court decisions that have shaped religion in American public life.
Jemar Tisby - Race, Religion, and the American Story
“Race never has to enter the story because it has always been in the story. From the very beginning, both race and religion have been present.”
Where does race enter the story of American Christianity? Historian Jemar Tisby explains how racial hierarchy shaped the nation’s founding, churches, politics, biblical interpretation, and continuing struggles over citizenship and equality.
Kristin Kobes Du Mez - Biblical Manhood and Power
“Ideals of masculinity are always linked to power: how power is wielded, who has that power, and to what ends that power is put.”
How did Christian manhood become associated with aggression, military strength, and political authority? Historian Kristin Kobes Du Mez traces how changing ideas about masculinity helped shape white evangelicalism, the Religious Right, and support for powerful political leaders.
Leah Payne - Contemporary Christian Music
“The music and the culture around the music did way more for them when it came to forming their doctrines and their political orientations.”
How did contemporary Christian music become a powerful force in evangelical life? Historian Leah Payne explains how artists, record labels, Christian bookstores, celebrity culture, and consumer demand helped shape evangelical theology, politics, gender expectations, and childhood formation.
Andrew Whitehead and Samuel Perry - Christian Nationalism
“Christian nationalism is the desire to fuse a very particular expression of Christianity with American civic life.”
What is Christian nationalism, and how does it shape the way people understand power, identity, family, race, and citizenship? Sociologists Andrew Whitehead and Samuel Perry explain the research behind the term and what the data reveal about its influence on American public life.
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Matthew D. Taylor - Christian Imperialism and Political Power
“There is a logic of Christian nationalism and Christian imperialism that wants to say one of these movements has to triumph in the end for them to accomplish their goals.”
How did Christianity become intertwined with empire, prophecy, spiritual warfare, and political rule? Scholar Matthew D. Taylor connects the legacy of Christian imperialism to the New Apostolic Reformation, the prophetic movement surrounding Donald Trump, January 6, and contemporary Christian nationalism.
Brian Kaylor - Religion Reporting and Government Worship
“A religion reporter is starting with the religion angle as the forefront.”
What happens when journalists miss the religion shaping the story? Brian Kaylor explains why theological context matters and discusses Christian worship services inside the Pentagon, the version of Christianity being elevated there, and what it means for religious liberty.
Books That Inspired This Series
The conversations in Church & State 250+ were shaped by years of scholarship on religion, history, race, law, politics, and American identity. All of the books below were written by guests featured in the series and helped us understand how faith has influenced the American story from before the founding through the present day.
Select any book cover to learn more or purchase it through our Bookshop.org store.
